And I really wouldn't challange Kopper on subject matters like what's a scene and what's a subculture. He knows more than Wikipedia.

Goth isn't just a scene, it's a way of life, hence, a subculture. Pretty much, a scene IS a subculture. If you're just talking about dressing in black, then you're talking about goth style, not subculture. And really, you don't want to be in that scene. It's just as bad as hanging out in a squatted house. Depressing. Johnny Paradox said:

When I say subculture, I mean I like to dress in black, I am being myself. :) Emo is dead anyway. SCENE is what you're reffering to haha.

kopper said:

Fuck the subculture. Goths are about as annoying as emo kids. Just dig the music and be yourself.

Johnny Paradox said:

Thanks guys, I am just getting into the "Goth" subculture and the new tunes will be welcome :)

Jody Reynolds! Endless Sleep is pretty gothic, isn't it. S.Law said:

jamie said:

More important I think, is building music on tradition with a proper foundation based on the theory of rock and roll archetypes from the 50s and 60s.

in that case, Jody Reynolds! anybody mention Christian Death? First album, the ones after are snoozers to me(tho they definately fit the depresso rock thing).

Kilslug!

jamie said:

More important I think, is building music on tradition with a proper foundation based on the theory of rock and roll archetypes from the 50s and 60s.

In Australia we had groups like The Birthday Party, Moodists, Scientists, who went to England and did alot of gigs with those kind of British Goth bands like Bauhaus, Siouxsie, Sisters of Mercy etc. Locally the Birthday Party kind of sound was popular with lots of groups in the early 80s, such as Grong Grong, and Box of Fish, and described with words like "grunge" and "swamp". That kind of Gun Club/Cramps kind of vibe also crosses over with the uk Psychobilly scene, and groups like Alien Sex Fiend, Bone Orchard, and Sunglasses after Dark were fairly Gothic but included on a Psychobilly compilation album. Some British Anarcho Punk groups also cross over into Gothic a bit too, Squatting Hippie/Punks into Hawkwind and Crass and occult, stone henge insence crap. And the "Gothic Subculture" probably comes from the New Romantic clubbing scene (yuck).

I don't think "Gothic" is a real genre as such, but is more of a dark vibe that you can overlay onto almost any music style. More important I think, is building music on tradition with a proper foundation based on the theory of rock and roll archetypes from the 50s and 60s.

Oh yeah, I think Deadbolt is worth a look as well.

Try Morbid Opera, a Florida band who mostly did stuff in the 80s. Female fronted band, their singer just died actually. I always thought they had a unique sound, a little more raw than the average band like this. Many of these bands are just too polished and full of themselves for my taste. I think their stuff is really hard to find now though.

45 grave had some good punk/goth crossover type stuff going.

Siouxsie and Bauhaus have always been hit or miss for me, but when they are good, they're really good.

My other faves have already been named, though I wouldn't consider most of them goth other than some of the horror subject matter. Original Misfits, Samhain, Damned, Roky Erickson, TSOL, Cramps, Screaming Lord Sutch, Screaming Jay Hawkins..

Deja Voodoo an 80s band from Canada (there are a bunch of bands who later used this name) who formed Og Records had some good horror material. They were very Cramps like, but more lo-fi.

My absolute favorite though is Color Me Psycho, another 80s Canadian band who had a garage type sound. If you ever see their Pretend I'm Your Father LP snatch it up!! Tom Bagley the singer went on to form Forbidden Dimension, one of the best horror bands of all time. They are still going strong after 20 years and have a lot of 7"s and some CDs out.

I would highly suggest The Return of the Living Dead soundtrack as a good starting point. Almost every song on it is good. You get 45 Grave, TSOL, Flesheaters, Roky, Tallboys, Cramps and the Damned all on one records!

When I say subculture, I mean I like to dress in black, I am being myself. :) Emo is dead anyway. SCENE is what you're reffering to haha. kopper said:

Fuck the subculture. Goths are about as annoying as emo kids. Just dig the music and be yourself.

Johnny Paradox said:

Thanks guys, I am just getting into the "Goth" subculture and the new tunes will be welcome :)

Fuck the subculture. Goths are about as annoying as emo kids. Just dig the music and be yourself. Johnny Paradox said:

Thanks guys, I am just getting into the "Goth" subculture and the new tunes will be welcome :)

Thanks guys, I am just getting into the "Goth" subculture and the new tunes will be welcome :)

I guess to a certain extent Pere Ubu could be included as well. Alex Patton said:

And later Damned stuff could very easily be considered Goth. Big Black is another good band in that vein.

And later Damned stuff could very easily be considered Goth. Big Black is another good band in that vein.

Hey, that guy covered pretty much all of that stuff. Another really awesome, awesome, awesome band along the lines of Wire, Joy Division, and all that early eighties synth heavy darker stuff is Magazine. It's the band that Howard Devoto started after he left the Buzzcocks and they are classic. The album Real Life is fantastic. It has a very morbidly cryptic feel to it. I dig it. It kind of reminds me of Devo on a bad acid trip.

kopper said:

I still listen to Bauhaus now and then. It's funny... the Dirtbombs' version of "Kung Fu" (where they basically incorporate "Bela Lugosi's Dead" into a cover of Curtis Mayfield's classic soul number) actually got me listening to them again when Ultraglide in Black came out in 2001. Listened to that album right after it came out almost non-stop while driving to NYC just a month after 9/11 for Cavestomp. CLICK HERE to listen. I'd probably avoided Bauhaus since the mid-'80s before then. Tones on Tail, Lords of the New Church, Southern Death Cult, etc. I like Joy Division a lot, too. I remember having the "Black Planet" album by Sisters of Mercy back then, too, but I just can't listen to that stuff anymore without laughing.

I guess the Damned could be considered goth punk, right? Still listen to them, although I've never been too crazy of their post-Strawberries stuff. Try Phantasmagoria, though. And once in a while I'll still listen to the Misfits, especially around Halloween (although I still prefer the Cramps). Do you like the Cramps? Not "goth" but they do sing about dead stuff, zombies, and whatnot. Kinda spooky! And the Mummies, haha! ;)

But seriously, here are some bands you should seek out. The following aren't typically considered "goth," more like dark-themed garage, punk/rock'n'roll, art punk, black metal, swamp rock, avant-garde, etc., but you might like them:

T.S.O.L.
The Wipers
Gun Club
Hoodoo Gurus
Satan's Cheerleaders
The Fiends
Wire
Nick Cave & the Bad Seeds
The Honeymoon Killers
Poison 13
The Gories (Mick Collins' band before the Dirtbombs)
Dwarves (Horror Stories or Lick It LPs)
Dead Moon
Destruction Unit
The Hex Dispensers
Lost Sounds
Suicide
Roky Erickson & the Aliens
The Horrors (from Cedar Rapids on In The Red Records, not the UK band)
The Hunches
The Blowtops
Mystery Girls
Television
Modey Lemon
The Monsters (The Lightning/Reverend Beat-Man's band!)
The Fuzztones
The Priests
New Salem Witch Hunters
The Nomads
Radio Birdman
The Nevermores
Rocket From the Tombs
The Original Sins
Demon's Claws
Cheater Slicks
Black Time
The Deadly Snakes
The Fall
The Screamers
Crime
Brian Eno
The Mirrors
The Daily Void
The Gris Gris
Subsonics
The Vipers
Ty Segall
Haunted George (ha!)
And you'd probably like the Black Lips, too, although you've probably already heard them. Try their earlier stuff, though.

And for '60s stuff, try the Monks, Sean Bonniwell's Music Machine, Love, the Seeds, 13th Floor Elevators, the Calico Wall, Electric Prunes, the Haunted, Can, the Velvet Underground, Zakary Thaks, Them, Stooges, Godz, Captain Beefheart, early (Syd Barrett-era) Pink Floyd, the Omens, Pebbles comps, and, yeah, ok, the Doors. Oh, and Screaming Jay Hawkins. ;)

I keep more or less that list handy whenever someone asks me if I like goth rock. I realize it's all over the place, but seriously, check some of them out if you haven't already. You might get sucked in!

My jukebox has "R.I.P." by Alien Sex Fiend on it but it sounds more punk than goth.

the kids who play "guitar hero" and think they are actual musicians will love it!

A guitar smashed in one swing? It kind of devalues the whole thing. Pete wouldn't like it, I expect!
If they've got balls they should smash their Teisco or their les paul (though I have to say that if I ever see someone smash a Teisco del rey, I'd smack him or her in the face... If you want to smash a les paul, well, have a ball then).

Before everyone gets their panties in a bunch over this, they need to realize that this is actually a toy and being sold as one at Amazon.JP http://www.smash-guitar.com/index_eng.html If I was to find one at a local store I might even buy one for the novelty factor, just like I am often tempted to buy one of those First Act Discovery guitars when I see them on the clearance table. Of course my wife often talks me out of doing such foolish things.

We just started this adventure, still learning to play. So the setup is with stuff that is cheap, we could source and doesn't take up much room - whilst trying to be true to old garage.

Me: Danelectro Deadon? Reissue Baritone --> BYOC Leeds Fuzz (superfuzz clone) --> zoom g2 (surprisingly good reverbs and delays in cheap box) --> Vox Ac10tv ??? (tiny little valve amp)
Vocals --> SM58 --> Behringer Analog Delay (pretty much the only piece of gear Basterdringer make that sounds awesome) --> Boss Bass Overdrive

Mah Missus: Cocktail drum kit. Vocals into a Sennheiser sometin.

The kitchen has proven to be the best sounding room to practice in. So I guess we're kitchen punks.

Cool, they were one of the 1st punk bands I ever saw play.

Just read this online:

Well, that's not a legitimate release. That's an old GaragePunk.com Forum Comp (not a physical CD)! There were hundreds of those. I have a bunch, but not that one (and I don't think the download is valid anymore, either). Did anyone grab that from Mikael when it was originally offered? For some reason I missed it... Rinjo Njori said:

There is a two disc set called songs we taught the detroit cobras-- I have never seen a physical copy but it has pretty much every song the Cobra's covered, here kopper said:

That is a great list. Basically, look for the original versions of all the songs the Detroit Cobras cover, and you're off to a good start.

Also, one of my favorite albums of modern soul would have to be the Now Time Delegation's LP (featuring the vocals of Lisa Kekaula of the BellRays). Black Joe Lewis is good, too (and he's playing in St. Louis next week). The screamin' Soul Preacher said:

Great great list Chessman !
Chessman said:

Well, some of these may be more 'proto-soul' then what you're after, but I still think they rate pretty high on the 'danceability' scale...

Lonnie Youngblood - African Twist pt.2
Smokey Johnson - Whip It Pts 1 & 2
Don Gardner - My Baby Likes To Boogaloo
Gino Washington - Come Monkey With Me
The Ideals - Go Go Gorilla
Eddie Kirk - The Hawg
James Brown - And I Do Just What I Want
Gary U.S. Bonds - I Wanna Holler
Otis Redding & The Pinetoppers - Shout Bama Lama
Dottie Campbell - He's About A Mover
Joe Tex - Ain't I A Mess
Jimmy Stokely & The Exiles - It's Alligator Time
Billy Lamont - Sweet Thing (w/h Hendrix on guit.)
Nathaniel Mayer - I Want Love And Affection (Not The House Of Correction)
J.C. Davis - The Chicken Scratch
Bo Diddley - Jo-Ann

Cheers,

Chessman

There is a two disc set called songs we taught the detroit cobras-- I have never seen a physical copy but it has pretty much every song the Cobra's covered, here kopper said:

That is a great list. Basically, look for the original versions of all the songs the Detroit Cobras cover, and you're off to a good start.

Also, one of my favorite albums of modern soul would have to be the Now Time Delegation's LP (featuring the vocals of Lisa Kekaula of the BellRays). Black Joe Lewis is good, too (and he's playing in St. Louis next week).

The screamin' Soul Preacher said:

Great great list Chessman !
Chessman said:

Well, some of these may be more 'proto-soul' then what you're after, but I still think they rate pretty high on the 'danceability' scale...

Lonnie Youngblood - African Twist pt.2
Smokey Johnson - Whip It Pts 1 & 2
Don Gardner - My Baby Likes To Boogaloo
Gino Washington - Come Monkey With Me
The Ideals - Go Go Gorilla
Eddie Kirk - The Hawg
James Brown - And I Do Just What I Want
Gary U.S. Bonds - I Wanna Holler
Otis Redding & The Pinetoppers - Shout Bama Lama
Dottie Campbell - He's About A Mover
Joe Tex - Ain't I A Mess
Jimmy Stokely & The Exiles - It's Alligator Time
Billy Lamont - Sweet Thing (w/h Hendrix on guit.)
Nathaniel Mayer - I Want Love And Affection (Not The House Of Correction)
J.C. Davis - The Chicken Scratch
Bo Diddley - Jo-Ann

Cheers,

Chessman

I actually did the soap box music lecture last night. Younger friends that had never even listened to the Stooges. After I heard that I went to the store and bought two Four Lokos. It turned into a very long night.

I am having the great debate with myself on releasing what I want to/what is cool/what will sell. It is hard. I would like to get back something of my investment in these releases. I see folks selling my stuff on eBone (mostly promos mailed out for Press/Booking or as Gifts over the years) and someone is making $$ offa my "labors of love", but I ain't makin' sheeittt from it. Free downloads and MP3 rips (fortunately not my stuff) has pretty much taken what was once a cool indie business market into, "What can I get fer Nuthin'" on-line. I buy stuff from bands who come through town when I can, and put out the stuff I wish would be out there, but in this "Downmarket Economy" it is like "pissing in the wind without a raincoat"! It just gets tiresome, once the novelty wears off. I ain't quitting though, because no-one else will release what I want out there. I have some new things that will be "Ultra Limited Releases" (300 units and no more) on both CD and vinyl. Cool stuff! Hopefully someone will dig it! Mole said:

State Records aren't exactly broke, but cash flow is soooooo tight!! Our problem is that so far we've only put out 7" vinyl, which is super-cool, but so many people are reluctant to take it cos there's no real profit to be made etc., and you've gotta shift so many copies to start recouping. But as many comments on here support, it's a labour of love and I don't believe anyone runs any indie/niche/cult/whatever-you-wanna-call-it label SPECIFICALLY to make money, they do it for the love of the music, and also there's a buzz to having total control over your output. Stick with it guys, the more the merrier!!


Ghosts Run Wild/Thee Haints said:

Definitely broke here. For all of the work we put into releasing things, sure it would be really cool to at least break even. And we haven't given up on that. But like some others have said, this is more of an obsession type thing. You don't really get involved in making/releasing this type of music for money. I'm not suggesting that you are or anything. I think the best we can do is try to support the small labels that we like. The other part is, you can't give up. The more good stuff you release, the more people should eventually find out about your label and buy stuff from it. Which equals you putting out more. There are some places that have made a success out of putting out niche music, look at Norton.